Isha  0:00  

Welcome to the Revolutionary Rompereglas podcast where we converge at the intersection of ancestral inheritance, spirituality, trauma healing, pleasure, intimacy, magic and leadership. I’m Isha Vela, somatic expressive alchemist for new era healers, change agents and bridge builders. I believe that unraveling fractured concepts of ourselves that live in our emotional, spiritual and mental systems, while moving towards sovereignty and devotion is the real work towards our personal and collective liberation. In this first season of the podcast, I’m interviewing New Era leaders who are sharing their personal journeys, and how it’s brought them to the purpose led work they do now. Occasionally, I’ll chime in with my own inspired episodes. But my intention is that the conversations and the tools shared in the podcast will inspire and support you on your own magical healing journey to owning yourself fully. 

Welcome Pamela Barba to the podcast. I’m so excited to have Pamela here. She is somebody that I’ve been in community with for about a year. She is someone who expresses her creativity in such unique ways. She is someone who believes that marginalized folks will lead the way to a liberated future. She’s a design strategist who helps entrepreneurs and creators launch and scale their one of a kind ideas. And as a previously undocumented immigrant, she became an advocate for economic justice after her family lost everything and migrated to the US. After spending a lifetime in the design and entrepreneurship space, she learned that space and self trust are key in the creation process. She is now obsessed with helping marginalized folks transform their communities by demystifying innovation and guiding them to trust their inner fire. I love that. Her grounded advice, and trust me it really is, has been featured on Forbes and on stages nationwide. Whatever the case, whatever the WiFi is connecting, is connecting Pamela is on a mission to help folks start some shit. Welcome, Pamela.

Pamela Barba  2:13  

Thank you. Hey, Isha.

Isha  2:17  

So you’re here to talk about the creative process and I just want to share that I so enjoy receiving your emails and seeing your posts because there’s so much creativity in everything that you do. It’s just bursting with creativity.

Pamela Barba  2:35  

I love that. Thank you. You know, I always think about like, my eight year old self or my like, my seven year old self, you know, and when you say that, I’m like, man, she’s glowing. She is so happy that that’s what I do.

Isha  2:49  

Yeah. And every time I see something, I’m just so curious about how you make it, how you, how do you do it? How do you make those beautiful posts?

Pamela Barba  2:59  

On a practical level for, I think what you’re referring to is a lot of like my Instagram stuff, and that I use a program called procreate on the iPad. So it is very much like drawing on the screen with a pencil. But on a more like theoretical level, I think I spent a lot of time trying to be something that I’m not. And so now I’m like just very rooted in being who I am. And it’s you know, it’s a process. Sometimes I forget who I am. But I think that’s part of what comes through in my stuff.

Isha  3:34  

Yeah, I do want you to share a little bit of your, your story and your background, your process getting to this place to talk about the process of creativity.

Pamela Barba  3:45  

Yeah. So it really starts, like, I grew up in a small business family. And what’s interesting is that when I was born in Ecuador, my family was actually like, pretty well off. And then there was an economic crisis, all these things happened. And so we lost everything. And we moved here. And so I always grew up around entrepreneurship. My mom was a clothing designer when I was younger, now she’s a floral designer. So my house was always like a place where innovation was admired. And then I went on to study graphic design when I went to college, you know, picking a career that I knew that I could help my parents with, like ASAP. Like, I was like, graphic design, I can help them with the business marketing, all the things. But you know, through that process, dealing with immigration, coming undocumented, also like working with community activists and nonprofits and all these different industries, I started to develop this idea that like all of these people were doing something right. Like community activists, there’s so many amazing things. There are so many cool things that happen in tech. There’s so many cool things that happened in nonprofit, but it seems like there wasn’t like a place that, like applied all of these things. So when I was 27, and, you know, I had this like fire within me to, like, do something to help people. I was really burnt out of corporate, Trump had just been elected and I felt like I wanted to do something. And so I started becoming really curious about like, huh, what if I could blend my small business experience and what I know about tech and what I know about design, and what I know about community organizing, and create something that I can help my community with. So that was back in 2017, with my first kind of project being Vamos Ladies, which was focused on economic empowerment for Latinas. And then I’ve just learned a whole lot since then.

Yeah. And you, you talk a lot about the design process. And that’s really what you’re, what you’re wanting to come on to talk about today. So tell us a little bit about your journey in exploring your own design process, or your career creative process, rather.

So I am a classically trained designer, I have my Bachelor’s of fine art. So I learned it that way. Right. And then when I went into like entrepreneurship and trying to learn about innovation, whatever program I was in, I’ve been in a million different programs, I learned about creation in that way. There is like a framework of like, you start, you have ideas, you try things, once you try things, you pick, you know, the ones that are working, and you kind of like keep iterating from that. So that’s very much like the design process, the UX, lean startup, like it’s all kind of like the same thing. So my process has been to learn the formal process, and then to break the rules. Because a lot of the times being in those spaces, which are very, male, very white male, they have a very specific way of asking you to show up in the world, which not all of us are able or want to do. Very much it has been about like learning, like, how does this work? And then learning how do I make it work for me? And then I, as I started teaching other people, especially other women, I started realizing, like, oh, kind of the – the things that I did work for other women too. So maybe like, I’m onto something, maybe there’s another way to do this.

Isha  7:30  

So when you talk about how in that white, patriarchal world, you were asked to show up, what was it like?

Pamela Barba  7:38  

So, no feelings, no emotions, show up perfectly, especially in like design and tech, like, don’t you dare show somebody something in process or in progress, like it has to be done. It has to be perfect. It has to look effortless. And it has to be like, cool. Like, it can’t be something everybody else is doing. But also like it has to fit within like a mental picture of what people have. So there are a lot of like, very stiff rules.

Isha  8:09  

Yeah, a lot of performance. A lot of mask. Yeah, not a lot of room for vulnerability. And you know, creating something is extremely vulnerable. 

Pamela Barba  8:18  

Yes. 

Isha  8:19  

Extremely vulnerable. And so you’re having to just shut that down in order to exist in that space.

Unknown Speaker  8:25  

Totally. And, you know, it’s interesting, because even as I was going through design school, like most of my projects, had some sort of like social justice, you know, doing good aspect to it. And, you know, the message that I got from some of my professors was like, oof, like, be careful, you know, like, you don’t want to, you don’t want to walk into an interview, and you made this poster about this issue. And the person interviewing you is like, totally against that issue. So it’s a lot of like that old way of thinking. 

Isha  8:55  

Yes, yes. About like, how you appear and trying to please, trying to please others instead of pleasing yourself. 

Pamela Barba  9:02  

And staying in your place. 

Isha  9:04  

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Wow, there’s so much here. I want to name something, that one of the reasons you were invited to be on this podcast is because I think that you really have a you know, you talk about like, there not having been a lot of room for emotions or no room for emotions. And the fact is, one thing that I admire is that your work is very emotional. Like you’ve really swung the pendulum in another direction. And you address, you have like, wonderful ways of bringing emotion into the creative process. Can you talk more about that?

Pamela Barba  9:40  

Yeah. So when I quit my job in 2017, and I really had no plan, like, no savings. I am very privileged that my partner had a stable job and that I was able to say, you know, Hey, babe, I’m not going to pay rent for a while. I need you to back me up here. And he did. But when I started that I had nothing, like, and I had just walked off of a job where in tech, I was really burnt out. I mean, I’m talking like crying every night, like drinking a drink every day, which is not like my norm. And so I really was like, at like ground zero, like I had nothing. And at that point, what I started doing is I started sharing how I was feeling, because I had like nothing left, you know, and something that I hate about, like, the way that things function in this country is that, especially for younger people who enter the workforce, like your job becomes everything, your friends, what you do, it becomes your whole life. And so when you walk away from that you like literally have lost your identity. So I was in that point, where I just started writing about how I was feeling, not really expecting anybody to answer or anything. And then I would get DMs from people being like, Oh, my God, like, I needed to see that. So, thank you. And so I was like, Okay, I guess I do that right. I mean, like, I at that point, I felt like I didn’t know how to do anything else right?

Isha  11:08  

Yeah. Yeah. Wow. So where did it go from there?

Pamela Barba  11:12  

I started writing more. And that point, I was like, I knew I had to pick something to focus on. Immigration is, well, oof I get so fired up about immigration. I really felt like, there wasn’t much I could do there. Like, I was like, I don’t know how to fill out paperwork, I’m really bad at it. I don’t have money to like give to people for their process. And so I decided to focus on economic empowerment. So I started writing more about the Latina wage gap. I started interviewing people to try to understand kind of how is their self worth tied to their identity? And how does it affect Latinas differently? And from that point, I kind of started entering into like tech incubators, which are these like programs to help you build a startup. So I tried building like a mentorship platform for Latinas. I kind of just like, kept following that, until eventually, I honestly, I just ran out of money. I ran out of credit cards to continue funding my research. And by that point, I had met a lot of mostly women of color, like myself, who were launching things for their communities, and who were struggling with a lot of the same things that I was struggling with. But I had an advantage, I think, due to my tech and design background, in that way. So I started helping people with the things that I knew that I could help with.

Isha  12:34  

Yeah, I just want to share too for those listening that you have a really strong sense, like this – the researcher in you. And you know, I consulted with you a couple of times, and you really took me through the customer experience, and you’re really tapped into people’s inner world. You know, as a psychologist, like, I feel like I have a pretty good sense of what people need. And in fact, like you have a much better sense of people’s experiences as customers that I found to be so valuable. The way that you approached and the way that you – your perspective on the journey, and what people are looking for, what people are needing was really, really eye opening for me. So that research, you have it in you. That’s a really different energy than what I see most people in marketing. It’s not the same. You really stand out in that way. Yeah. Talk a little bit more about the the piece around safety.

Unknown Speaker  13:40  

Yeah. And thank you, thank you for saying that. Yes, it’s interesting, because I actually, I was talking to one of my friends who is also a marketer, and she was telling me, oh, I have this client, they would be so easy, like, they don’t really care about this, they’ll just pay you to do it. And that’s when I had a moment where I was like, no, like my people, the people that I love working with are the people that are like, so passionate, so angry, so fired up that they like can barely like speak about it, you know? And what happens when we are so passionate and we are experts in what we do, is sometimes we can forget what that looks like for people who don’t know as much as we do, or you know, have a different experience. So I really do love to help people really dig into their audience and like, understand how our people are approaching your work. So the safety piece, you know, what’s really interesting is, I had one of those experiences that I think are really unique when I was in this tech incubator for Black and Latina women. And this incubator was like nine months to help you create like a tech product, to help you get investments, to help you with all of those things, right. And by like a life coincidence, at the same time, I was an adjunct design professor at my university, they invited me to come teach for a semester. And so I had this really unique experience where I was going through this incubator, which was like one of the most difficult things I had ever done. And then at the same time, I was teaching students to design, and I was teaching them to design brands, etc. And I started kind of noticing this pattern, you know, with my students like, there are my students who, you know, who come from families that know that graphic design is like a legit career, who have money to live on campus who have money to buy a computer, who have support from their family, who aren’t working. And the thing with design, it’s a very visual field, obviously, but unlike writing where like, you might write something and your professor sees that but nobody else does – in design, everybody sees what you create. If you’re creating a brand, we literally put it up and we look at what everybody did. And so I started noticing a difference between my students who clearly came from a safer background, versus my students who were riding the bus to school, you know, coming in on the weekends to use the school computers, working three jobs, and the risks that they were able to take, obviously, the work with design and a lot of art, a lot of the times the amount of time that you put into it shows. Especially when you’re first learning. 

Isha  16:19  

Yes. 

Pamela Barba  16:19  

And so clearly, like my students who had that access to safety, they were able to spend 20 hours on a project when somebody else had less time. And I started noticing the same thing happening in this incubator that I was in. Those who had support, whether from a partner or from a job who had that security, the way they showed up in the incubator, which met twice a week – it was pretty intense – was different than those who were like really struggling with childcare or struggling because their partners weren’t supportive of what they were doing, or because they were working three jobs, etc. And so I started to, to realize that well, number one, really, the creation process is the same whether you’re making a poster or starting a business. And two, that safety was a huge piece in you being able to take bigger risks. And it’s really those bigger risks that amount to bigger rewards.

Isha  17:15  

When you talk about safety, how does fear play into that? Like, what is the connection between them? Because you’re talking about safety and it sounds like you’re, you’re connecting it to support? And I’m wondering how fear plays a role?

Unknown Speaker  17:29  

Yeah, that’s a really good question. It’s interesting, because I think all of us are afraid, I think some of us are better at lik,e being like, alright, we’re just going to keep moving with the fear. Because the consequences of whatever you do are smaller, I think. So for example, you know, people that I know, that quit their jobs, but maybe had like savings, and so it wasn’t such a huge risk, like, sure they had fear, but the impact that it could have on their lives is smaller than for me, who has like student loans and credit card bills and my family, you know, depends on me and all these things. To me, the fear is, like, kind of proportional to the amount of safety that you have, in a way.

Isha  18:12  

Yeah. And it’s a question I asked, because, you know, to tell on myself here, fear and self doubt have been sort of my biggest demons in the creative process. Like, and it’s not connected necessarily to money. Although, you know, right, if I don’t create a certain amount, well, like, then I don’t, I can’t feed myself, etc. But it feels more like a, like a deeper place around like, how I’m seen or being judged, or, you know, things like that, like the self doubt around is it good enough, how will it be received. Yeah, there’s a – there’s some deep, deep places to go into there.

Pamela Barba  18:57  

Yes, totally. Totally. And I’ve worked with dozens of people. And we all have that fear and self doubt. It just manifests in different ways. And you know, it’s sneaky. No, it’s sneaky and it, and it gets in there. But to me, that’s why it’s so damaging to be in these programs like that I’m mentioning are these spaces that demand perfection, that demand that you don’t talk about emotions, because we’re not really addressing those fears, and that lack of safety, which once you have that, you can build whatever. But what I see is a lot of people and myself included, you know, when I talk about, like my journey in all of this, is there’s a point where I was reading all business books, I was watching webinars, I was you know, getting coached by business coaches and sales people like all the time, and there was a point like it came to a screeching halt, because I realized that my problem wasn’t those like upper level strategies. My problem was it didn’t feel safe to get paid, it didn’t feel safe to make money.

Isha  20:07  

I wanted to briefly interrupt this conversation to let you know, you have just a few more days to register for my free three day series called intimacy and integrity. This series was inspired by my conviction, that new era leadership, whether it’s in your relationships at home or in your business, need to be trauma informed, energy attuned and intimate in order to build a culture of mutuality, receptivity and healing. And what I’m seeing, what I’ve seen is that there are limits to intimacy, when we have not healed or integrated some of our younger childhood wounds, and this results in defensiveness in protective patterns, strategies that actually stop the intimacy. They, they really block the intimacy and the love. And we do this unconsciously and suffer quite a bit as a result. And really, right now in history, it is so important, so vital, for the survival of our species, to be attuned to one another, to be able to see and feel each other. So over the three days, April, 14th, 15th, and 16th, the main themes will be decolonizing your concept of relationships, healthily expressing and integrating your shadow into your relationships, and leading with intimacy and integrity. And there’s so much more packed into those three main themes. And the series is designed to be beneficial for everyone, I really do believe it’s beneficial for everyone, but especially if you find yourself experiencing repetitive patterns, judgments, or worries in your relationship, if you feel like you’re holding back, and wanting to bring yourself more fully and honestly into your partnerships, if you desire to experience more connection and intimacy using the wisdom of your body, or even if you’re wanting to affect potential clients in ways that are healing. And this includes sales calls, and all of those aspects of entrepreneurship. I’m so excited to finally share this with you, the link to register is in the show notes. And I hope to see you there.

Pamela Barba  22:28  

And because of that, you know, the strategies were bringing me clients and bringing me things, but I just kept flicking them away.

Isha  22:37  

You know, this is something that I hear a lot from business coaches now, that it’s never about not having enough strategy. And there’s a place in us, the cycle that you were in was like, get more strategy, get more strategy, like your brain wants more strategy, to try to fix the problem that’s not related to strategy, that it’s always about the deeper work. And for me, entrepreneurship has been a whole spiritual journey, would you agree?

Pamela Barba  23:07  

Yes, yes. And oh my gosh. And that’s why I mean, I think entrepreneurship is such a great way to push you to personal growth. But also it’s like, it’s pretty intense. Because like, if you work for somebody, and you like kind of hit a wall with your personal growth, you can choose to sit there for years and not cross it because you’re still getting your paycheck, you’re still getting your life. But with entrepreneurship, when you hit a wall, you stop making money usually, or you become so overwhelmed. Yeah, I’ve become like obsessed, and figuring out like, what are these walls? And how do I gently move around them?

Isha  23:48  

Yeah, and I love supporting entrepreneurs, because there is so much around visibility, around showing up. And something that I – that I embrace for myself, and that I practice and that, you know, I think you do really well too, is the authenticity piece and in showing up as your flawsome self, right with all of your stuff, and still showing up, with the vulnerability. And allowing yourself to be seen in that and that people really respond. People really connect with that, because that’s how people are actually feeling.

Pamela Barba  24:23  

Yes, yes. And also, like, you know, perfectionism is one of the tenants of white supremacy, the fact that we have to show up perfectly, and I work with a lot of clients who are launching things. We’re working on their website, we’re working on their pitch deck, we’re working on their social media stuff. There’s often this like tether to like, well, it’s not perfect, or it’s not ready. There’s so much power in embracing, you know, the thing of just saying like, here’s what I have right now. And the lie that we’ve been told is that we do have to have that like perfect look. But that actually blocks us from being able to connect with people because people are seeking that authenticity. And one of the biggest comments that I get from people that just find me on the internet or whatever is they’re like, I just like how you were honest. And I try to tell this to my clients all the time, you know what, like, I understand. I think vulnerability is also like some sort of privilege, too. Like some people, some identities, some experiences, it is way more difficult to be vulnerable. And that’s something that, you know, I am very aware of, when I work with people.

Isha  25:34  

Mm-hmm. It’s part of the safety, right, if you don’t feel safe, to be vulnerable, but right, if you don’t have that, that basis of safety, it’s harder to be vulnerable, you know, you talk about, you show up, I was thinking about like authenticity or being yourself as being on brand, like just showing up as you is the new on brand, versus the colors versus all the other things like just being yourself is on brand. And that there’s people out there that say like, you don’t even need to niche, you’re the niche, right? Just you being you already attracts the people that respond to that. And that’s enough.

Pamela Barba  26:11  

I think the hard thing is that it takes practice, it takes a lot of vulnerability to practice, you know, especially like, it’s interesting, because I think about design a lot like literally design, like somebody’s learning how to use design software to make a poster or whatever. Because that’s the lens that I learned to look at, look at the world through. But even when you’re learning to design a poster, like, you design a bunch of posters that look like something somebody else already made, because you’re learning, and I think it’s the same when we’re learning to be ourselves is you kind of try on, like, let me try on this way of being and then you’re like, woof, that was not it. Or you’re like oh, I like this thing, you know, about the way I spoke, the way I showed up. So it takes some trial and error. Trial and error is like rooted in like being okay with being in progress.

Isha  27:04  

Yeah, so so many things come up for me, as you say that. What comes up is, as you try on these different ways of showing up, right, you you have to be in touch with some part of yourself where there’s resonance with it, or where there’s sort of like a, hmm, that doesn’t feel right. Like you have to trust your intuition. You have to trust your felt experience about like your sense of what that feels like. Also, the piece around imposter phenomenon comes up. And I think that you’ve you’ve had some lives on Instagram about that.

Pamela Barba  27:36  

Yes. To me, the hardest thing about all of this is that all of us have a voice and sign. Sometimes that voice is your intuition, your gut feeling telling you like, no, ma’am, not that way. Or like, yes, that was right. And sometimes that’s like your critic, that it’s not a helpful voice. And I know for me, so much of the journey has been, who’s speaking to me right now?

Isha  28:01  

Yeah.

Pamela Barba  28:02  

Like, sometimes I hear, ooh, girl, do not do that, you know? And it’s – and it’s from, actually, you should do it, you’re just really scared. You know, sometimes I hear that. And it’s truly from, like, that’s not aligned with you. So learning to tell that difference is huge.

Isha  28:18  

Yeah, that’s something that comes up in in my work as well. And I try to orient people like, where’s the voice coming from in your body? Right? If it’s coming from your head, it’s usually like, maybe not always the best. But if it’s coming from from your belly or something, or, you know, if it’s speaking to you in a harsh tone, question that, right, the neutral or the kind teacher is the one you might want to go with. But it sometimes is the – is the riskier choice, right, the risk, like put it out there or do this thing, you know, sometimes you get download from spirit, and you’re just like, really? Should I do that, and it’s like yes, do it, put it out there, and you’re scared shitless. And you’re doing it anyway. So yeah, it’s a, it’s an intense process.

Pamela Barba  29:07  

And I think that’s where having community can be really helpful, too. I mean, in all of this community is the most helpful, like, if anybody’s listening and you want to start anything, go find people who are doing it and who are talking about it. But it helps to be like witnessed, you know, to have somebody or even a coach or somebody that you’re working with, that’s like, like, hey, last time, you were kind of freaked out to do this. And now I hear it again, like are, you know, are we sure – and you were talking about imposter phenomenon a little bit ago – and so for me, like, understanding the cycle of imposter phenomenon is helpful because, and that’s something that I teach my clients, because it’s, it can be helpful to be like, hey, I see you hesitating, which is fine. Let’s just double check that this isn’t what’s happening. My approach is very much on helping people find ways of showing up that feel good to them. Sometimes it feels good, even though it’s a little bit scary. And then sometimes it’s a little bit scary and you have to try it anyway. So it’s about having somebody that understands you personally, to say, hey, but you know, this, you could do this. This is similar to this other thing that you did. Or, you know, you do this so well when you think nobody’s watching you.

Isha  30:24  

Right. Exactly. What has been your biggest hurdle to overcome in your process of entrepreneurship in your creative process?

Pamela Barba  30:36  

My biggest hurdle has been to, to let go of the idea that somebody else knows more than I do, about what I should be doing. Instead of like, being like, no, actually, I know what I should be doing. And I should listen to that inner voice before I listen to anybody else.

Isha  30:58  

What has that journey been like for you? What does it look like?

Pamela Barba  31:01  

Quite literally, years of following other people, and, and kind of like betraying myself and being like, I know I should have quit this, like six months ago. And I didn’t, and I’m not gonna do it again. And then I do it again. And I’m like, shit, I did it again. I said, I wasn’t going to. Now for real for real, you know. So literally years of, you know, being like, oh, maybe I could build my business this way. And then following somebody’s approaches perfectly, and then being like, that didn’t work for me. Or what happened a lot was, I could have made that work in a way that felt really, really, really bad. And so I choose not to. And so I think after doing that so much, I got to a point where I was like, I don’t even really care if this works or not anymore. I’m just like, not willing to betray myself again.

Isha  31:50  

Yes. And I think it was in the fall of last year, you took a break.

Pamela Barba  31:55  

I did. 2019 ended, I was still like, full-on doing Vamos Ladies and trying to figure out how to grow that community. And then when 2020 started, I was like, I have to make money this year. Like, I have gone too many years saying this is the year and I was like 2020, I was like, This is my year. I said money goals. I, you know, I started working with a sales coach, I like did all those things. And at the beginning of 2020, I was like, I’m gonna focus on helping people with branding. That’s my area of genius, I can, you know, I can help people with that. But then 2020 hit, and I was like, maybe I need to help people make money. So I’ll focus more on like, kind of like business coaching, brand coaching. And I like doubled down on that, because I felt that that’s what people needed, and part of my skill set is helping people figure out like systems and what services to offer, etc. But I stepped into this kind of like business coaching role, it just didn’t feel good. You know, my family, when they moved here, they started a business and that, thanks to that business, we have been able to live. But also because of that business, we have not been able to live. I started realizing through 2020 that I really wanted to help people create a life that they love, whether or not it is because of their business growing. So all of this was happening in me. And I just was again trying all these strategies from all the different coaches, not feeling good. And then around November of 2020, I was like, that’s it. Like, I did all the things that did not work. I got really into human design and astrology and just spent like a month listening to podcasts about human design and really working on becoming an akashic records reader. Like all these different things that I felt called to, but I felt like I couldn’t be that and a brand person and a business coach. And so that’s when I let go of all that and now I’m focused on creation and creativity and helping people trust their voice, you know, trust their fire, and create that safety for themselves. And for myself, too.

Isha  34:12  

That’s so amazing. I love how you sort of went into this other, you did like research, you went into this research place again. And in fact, I love Human Design as well. There’s a lot of people blending human design with business and how to approach business and how to approach even business structure or creative. What is your special sauce around? Like what you do right now with the creative process. What is your unique approach?

Pamela Barba  34:41  

My unique approach is really – right now I’m really interested and really focused on helping people stop listening to those outside voices, whatever they may be for them, and start figuring out how to trust themselves into doing something. So I’ve been doing these 30 day of creative risks challenges, where like, the whole purpose is for you just to create for 30 days. And so it’s interesting because in 2020, I ran this 30 day program, and I was like, I’m gonna teach you about strategy and marketing and your audience and, and all these things. And I had 10 women go through the program, and only one finished because people got so stuck on the strategy portion, they’re like, oh, but I don’t know who my audience is, you know, all these things. And it’s kind of ironic, because the only way to find the right strategy is to take a lot of experimentation, and just create things. And as you create things, you will start to be able to create a strategy around that. So I’ve shifted from focusing with people on strategy, to focusing on just helping them create things, take risks, use their voice, and then we can build a strategy on top of that. And of course, for my people who are like, more advanced or have been doing this for a while, have been creating, like, I do also work with people just on the strategy portion. But what I’m the most excited about is just to help people create anything.

Isha  36:10  

What’s coming up for me, as you’re talking right now is that, thinking about the safety piece again, right? If you’re from an immigrant family, if you’re from a family who maybe has fewer resources, maybe in your, in your most creative years, like in your, when you’re young, maybe there wasn’t as much room to create. And so you’re not as connected to that muscle, that muscle is just not as developed, right? There is something, there is a – maybe like a coaxing or a process where it’s really important to help people learn to make mistakes, to get used to doing something over and over again. And I see that with my own kids, that they make a mistake and they just keep trying, they do the same drawing 15 times, because they want to get it the way that they see it in their head, or they want to feel a sense of satisfaction. I know now in my adult self, like I, you know, in my own perfectionism, I give up on like, you know, try number two or three, you know, and don’t make as much room as my own kids make them for themselves. And so there’s something really there about like, what, what is that factor?

Pamela Barba  37:30  

Number one, kids are amazing. Like, we have so much to learn from them. I think it’s really an, kind of an embodiment practice in a very different way. You know, because we’re in a world that tells you like, if you want to call yourself a writer, you have to like fit all these requirements. Or if you want to call yourself a designer or a creative, like it’s like this external thing. But truly, if you want to be a writer, you just have to write every day for long enough, right? So it taps into this internal validation, it taps into – your skill starts advancing, the more that you do it, it taps into, there’s even this, like, this whole energetic thing I think that happens when you’re just living it that is able to bring you more of that. 

Isha  38:05  

Yeah, yeah. 

Pamela Barba  38:22  

Practical standpoint to is, the more that you do the work that you want to be doing, like, this is true for designers. Like if you’re a designer, and you want to be making a lot of websites, you have to make some websites for free or for cheap to put on your website so that people know you make websites and they call you for it. So this also taps into that, which is like, you want to be writing more or you want to be doing this, you kind of just have to do it until people know that you do it. And that’s how you become known as a person that does that.

Isha  38:48  

Yes, what you’re saying right now is also what I teach – in the practice itself, you become through the practice. I love that. I love that.

Pamela Barba  38:59  

And I think that that is what, you know, because most people that I work with are coming from a marginalized identity, who want to do something, they want to create a business or nonprofit, a project or an initiative to help their communities. But the wall that I most often see people hit, which is why I started focusing on this work right now, is that self trust, it’s not the lack of strategies. It’s not the lack of anything other than their doubting whether they can be this thing. And so through this practice, what I hope to strengthen is that, which then that confidence gets transferred into other areas of people’s lives. Like if I can do this and I can show up in this way, maybe I can apply for that job. Or maybe I can launch this thing or I can launch this service.

Isha  39:49  

Yeah, I think that you’re absolutely right. And I really hope people are getting this as they’re listening is that when you develop that muscle, right, whether it’s the courage muscle, or the vulnerability muscle, or the creative muscle, expands out into every area of your life, right, self trust. And that’s why that inner work, not the strategy, but the healing work is sort of a centerpiece of, of anything that you want to do in your life, however you want to create, whether it’s creativity in business or creativity in relationship and your sexuality, like however you want to do it. Yes, I love – I love that. I love that we’re here in this place, in the conversation. Yes. So Pamela, how can people get in touch with you? How can they get in contact with you? How can people access your services? 

Pamela Barba  40:08  

Yes, so I’m on Instagram, probably too much. So I’m Ms. like Ms., Pamela Barba on Instagram. And that’s also my website, MissPamelaBarba.com.. Those are the two best ways to get in touch with me.

Isha  41:03  

Yeah. What kind of services are you offering right now?

Pamela Barba  41:07  

Yes, so I’m actually I’m starting to host free community like accountability hours, where it’s like, literally, you know, log on to zoom, we’ll co-work. You’ll tell me what you’re working on, we’ll co-work. And then the session ends. So it’s just holding space for people to do whatever they need to do whether it’s like, you know, make that dentist appointment or write your bio, or look at your website, whatever. So I’m really excited about that. And then I will be relaunching my, my 30 day risk challenge. Probably in April, late April. 

Isha  41:42  

Perfect. Perfect. Yeah, awesome. Definitely. If you’re listening, jump on that. Pamela is amazing. Yes. Thank you so much for this conversation. Yeah, there was a lot of energy in this conversation. And I’m, I’m so happy that we made this time to meet and chat.

Pamela Barba  42:03  

Yes, this was fun. Thank you, Isha. Bye, everybody. 

Isha  42:07  

Bye.

That’s it for today’s episode. I hope this conversation supported you in accessing more of your truth and more of your energy. Remember to hit the subscribe button to get notified of new episodes dropping on the new and full moons of each month. And if you haven’t already, leave us a five star review on iTunes. Make sure that everyone who needs this transmission gets it. See you next time, Rompereglas.